In the latest episode of the MPI EVENTalks podcast, sponsored by Socio, we discuss the keys to success for hybrid and digital events, from broadcast quality to engagement to flexibility. We’re joined by Dale Hudson, knowledge and events director for the IMEX Group; Annette Gregg, senior vice president of experience for MPI; and Nolan Ether, content marketing leader for Socio.
The following is a transcript of that conversation.
Sarah: All right, here we go. So, I am super excited to be joined by three wonderful guests today on the MPI podcast, Dale, Nolan, and Annette. We are going to have an in-depth discussion about hybrid and the digital experience when it comes to really keeping the conversation going as we're getting back into in-person events, into our online space with our audiences. So of course, we are, we just wrapped up a phenomenal IMEX America in Las Vegas a little over a week ago, and I know we're all still recovering. Dale and I were chatting about this earlier, so it was such a wonderful week to get everyone together. But of course, that conversation started online well before IMEX America. So Dale, I want to start with you. And if you can give us a little glimpse into what the virtual component was like leading up to IMEX America? (0:04-1:00)
Dale: Hi, Sarah, lovely to see you again, and Annette and Nolan. The experience from the very beginning was actually quite a shock, I think, as it was to many people. We canceled IMEX Frankfurt and we realized quite quickly that we needed to try and do something that was going to make people feel still connected and still together. So, we really did the word pivot. I know we all hate it now, but we did. We did it within about 6 weeks to a virtual event, which we call planet IMEX one. We were calling it so it was a little island and you could go there and you could visit different rooms and you could go into different spaces and experience some education, experience some music. You could go meet people in the lobby. So, it was it was quite it was quite a complicated virtual situation and I have to say, for our very first one, we were almost like a lot of people were doing trying to recreate the event, the live event in a virtual environment, and it was massively complicated. It was very difficult and it probably nearly killed half our team. So, I think that to say that we pulled it off, we did, and I thought it was beautiful. We really did keep people together. We got the most amazing feedback. People were happy about it. But I think that, you know, on the second time around and then the third, we kept learning each time we went. We did a planet IMEX too, which was again a bit more scaled down, a little bit more focused. And then we went into buzz hubs, which were very much once every month, and people came and joined us for the buzz hub and then left that, then fed into the broadcasting studio, which went to the show floor, which was also classified as a buzz hub, but it was a little bit more of the virtual side at the show. So, I'm going to say that it wasn't the easiest experience for anyone, and I don't think it has been for anyone. And we didn't know what we didn't know really, until we actually went through the process and really started to learn and understand what it was. We had to learn and understand. (1:01-3:12)
Sarah: Yeah, it really was a robust strategy to develop this kind of experience, and I think we've all made the mistake, you know, as you said, Dale, you don't know what you don't know and our industry didn't know how to do virtual events a completely virtual event. And I think what a lot of us did was really try to replicate that in-person experience into an online space. So Annette, I want to go to you because similar to IMEX America and the broadcast studio that they had in Las Vegas, I know WEC, we've had two WECs over the past year, starting with WEC20 in Grapevine, leading into WEC21 in Las Vegas. What were those digital experiences like and how did WEC20 differ from 21? (3:13-4:05)
Annette: Well, thanks, Sarah. It was very interesting to see the difference. And we produced our WEC20 in November that year and we did have a fully hybrid experience. We had a live conference going on in Grapevine and then we had an online live, all of our presenters were live as well. We didn't have any prerecorded content for our online. So, for them, it was quite an undertaking, as Dale said, you know, we committed to, we didn't have many case studies to go by. That was still about six months into kind of the pandemic. So, what we learned with that first year, we had twice as many people online as live. So that would make sense in 2020 because everyone was still kind of in lockdown in that early stage, and we had a lot more kind of engagement, a lot of stickiness to the sessions. And because we promoted that, hey, these are live sessions, you're going to tune in, you're going to watch WEC, but you're going to watch this speaker live. We didn't really promote that, that you could watch that later or that this is recorded and feel free to access it whenever you want. We really wanted that engagement to be live because we wanted, we also tethered it to the WEC live experience in Grapevine. So, I think what really works that year is that we really did integrate the live and virtual audience very intentionally. So, we had for our main stage general sessions, we had several times where we pulled in that virtual audience and it became part of the content. They became part of the gamification, the questioning, and the emcees were joking with the online audience and the virtual audience, and it really felt like they were fully integrated. And then we went to about 8 months later, we had our second version of hybrid during COVID for our World Education Congress, and we had twice as many people on site versus online. So, it’s kind of flip flopped, and that's obvious to 21 people are getting a little more comfortable traveling. And we chose to have a little bit more flexibility in the offering for that second go around because what we learned just from the data and from how even the learner expectations had evolved just over that 8 or 10 month in between is that people were we're getting a lot of these virtual experiences now, a lot of these hybrid experiences. So, they wanted the flexibility of kind of consuming the content when they wanted to consume it. So, we crafted our digital experience with a lot more variety of just different learning styles, if you will, you know, quick hits interactive one on one meetings, deep dives, if you wanted to, and you definitely could access it on demand whenever you wanted to. So, we just realized we had to be more flexible as time went on, because the as we have all done during pandemic, we just need the flexibility in our lives, our personal professional lives. So, I think we also learn some of our key takeaways where you really do need a focused team building out that digital and hybrid experience. We had a whole live team producing that side of things. You need a focused producer to really focus on the online experience and the virtual experience. The quality of the broadcast was key for us. So, Sarah, you know, you are our virtual emcee and host along with Jessie States. We had a full broadcast studio that we built out. We didn't want it to look like the online audience got any kind of secondary experience. We wanted it to feel like that Saturday Night Live experience and live and then again, the third learning was just the more flexibility, the better that people are really, there are just so many different ways people learn now, and so we had to offer a whole lot to keep everybody engaged. (4:06-8:00)
Sarah: Yeah, I think the word flexible is definitely part of our new vocabulary as meeting professionals and that even on that note, as in-person attendees having an offering the flexibility for in-person to perhaps have access to some of that virtual content as well, I think is key, right? Because although they're in person, they don't necessarily, they may still want the education that the virtual audience was able to get their hands on. So that flexibility piece kind of extends across audiences. (8:01-8:33)
Annette: Yes, it's super good point. (8:34-8:35)
Sarah: So, Nolan, with you at Socio, of course. You know, what's interesting with you guys is that your technology was actually mostly focused on the in-person and then evolved through the pandemic to support these virtual experiences that we're talking about here. So, can you speak to that evolution and how we're continuing to see technology evolve to support that flexibility that we're talking about? (8:36-9:02)
Nolan: Yes. Thank you for having me, Sarah. Good to see you again, ladies. What a crazy time we're living through. I just actually learned today that, you know, I always knew that Socio platform was founded as an in-person event platform. But what I didn't know is that the Shake to Connect feature that we now still have in the platform was actually the original product. So, so from the beginning, we were trying to figure out a way to sort of blend those experiences, right? How do we how do we not have to hand off a business card? How do we connect more seamlessly? And then as the pandemic hit, we, we quickly again to use our favorite word, pivoted into a virtual and hybrid world of virtual obviously took over most of 2020, and so we had a lot of focus on that, and I think that, Dale to your point, trying to figure out early on, are we mapping the in-person experience directly to a new virtual experience or is this something else? And I think over time what we've learned and as we've gone back into, you know, more in-person events and hybrid events is that we don't know, we're still figuring this out. We have a ton of great engagement features, which we'll talk about, I'm sure later. But the way to keep people engaged in the way that these events are going to sort of be shaped in the future. I think that we're still sort of stuck in our ways of thinking about in-person as one thing and virtual is one thing and hybrid is sort of the blend, when in reality, I think what we're building at Socio is something that's going to be for, you know, we're calling it hybrid now. But this new model of events that doesn't really necessarily care where you are, how you're consuming the content, or when you're consuming content. So, it's a little bit, it's going to be somewhere in between what we what we see for our in-person and what we see for virtual. I mean, even what we're thinking about now as hybrid, which is really a blend of those features. There's going to be new learnings and new features, I think that come out and new ways of engaging and creating that content and engaging audiences that we haven't even thought of yet. (9:03-10:58)
Sarah: Yeah, I think our second word after flexibility is engagement, so leading us into engagement, and now that we really have experienced various ways of connecting online and doing these events online, meeting organizers are really honed in on that engagement piece because it's not just about sitting in front of your computer anymore and consuming content. How do you become an active participant in that content? So, Annette let's go to you. There's some interesting data out of the most recent meetings outlook that I think would be beneficial for our audience to know. (10:59-11:32)
Annette: Yes, and it really supports what Nolan was just saying. Over one third of our respondents said that their projected virtual attendance will be growing over the next 6 months for what they're planning on. So, for the meeting professional, it's really, I think, imperative for us to become consultative in our approach and we really need to know our audiences. If you think I'm a I'm a baby, no I’m a Gen Xer, but my son, and so I'm comfortable online, but my son, who's 21, that's his life. So, if your audience is skewing a certain way demographically, you're going to create a different online experience, maybe than if it's my generation. So, we have to know our demographics. We have to know who we're trying to reach and why is it just is it education? Is it mandated education safe or credentialing or for certification? Or is it engagement for community building in all of those goals and objectives? We've known this is meeting professionals all along, but the goal setting exercise and identifying what we're really trying to accomplish is even more imperative now because there are just so many more options. It's not a matter of if you want to go to this city or that city anymore. It's a matter of you want to go to this city with a side dish of this online experience with an extension of this 3-month experience afterwards. So it's, we just need to identify who were who were planning this for, what the goals are, and then we can apply the different modalities. (11:33-13:00)
Sarah: And it really is an exciting time, I know it's very stressful and it's a lot to think through as meeting professionals, but you know, there is kind of a beauty in this because I think there is a lot of this kind of discussion happening. How do you extend the life of your event? So, it's a year-round experience prior to COVID. And I think coming out of this, our hands were forced in that direction a little faster than we maybe wanted them to be. But now we really are seeing these communities online develop out of our events. So, Dale, let's go back to you. Annette mentioned extending the discussion from an in-person into these into this virtual community, if you will, our communities throughout the year. So, can you speak to how the IMEX Group has developed this successfully? (13:01-13:52)
Dale: Yeah, I mean, we’re still working on that. So obviously, as you know, as I mentioned earlier, we're still learning and working on it. But how I can see it working is that you extend conversations from your live event. So, for instance, if you have your corporate community together and they have a really solid conversation, how can we bring that as a follow up into the virtual world and continue those conversations? So, when you get back to the next live event, how have you developed that conversation? Has it gone further? I see it as an extension of life in a way of a lot of conversations, a lot of marketing pieces. If it can keep people together when you know they might be feeling like, oh, I could do with a peer group to talk to, perhaps you put a peer group virtual together for that group. So, I definitely see it as sort of an engagement piece, but keeping people connected throughout the year between the live event. So as Annette said, it's an extension rather than, you know, just throwing lots of different educational content pieces of people. I think we need to move away now from that. I think we did that because that's what we thought, let's just keep everybody educated, let's keep people together really motivated. So, I think that's what we were trying to get through during COVID is keep people happy in a way, you know, keep them, keep them engaged and educated. Whereas now going back to the life, I think I can safely say for myself, I get more engagement at a live event. I talk to people, I see people. Actually, I get that real sense of how are they feeling, an extended conversation because you can, which is a little bit more difficult on virtual. But then once we get to the virtual environment, like how can we say we've had that deep, deep conversation at the live event? So, what can we do with that in the virtual in order to get us to the next live event? So, I really just see it as an extended piece throughout the year with different groups and different communities, and perhaps we can allow some other communities to develop within our space. You know that there will likely be the sustainability group who would think I would like to have a piece and get the people together, and let's talk about something that we were talking about. So, I think it's an extension rather than just lots of different pieces of content going into the virtual. (13:53-16:25)
Sarah: Yeah, there's certainly no shortage of content, and it's really just helping facilitate continuing conversations between human beings, right? And it's doing so strategically. I mean, that's the basic foundation of this is how do we take what happens at your live meeting and really extend it into the virtual space so. (16:26-16:44)
Annette: Sarah, can I hone in on that? (16:45-16:46)
Sarah: Absolutely. (16:46)
Annette: This is Annette again. I think that's where these technologies can really help us. They're actually more efficient at connecting than the live engagement can be. You know if we fill out our participant profiles adequately and what we're looking for. I these tech platforms, right, socio, etc. they can, they can really create these conversations quickly between participants where we might be kind of stumbling along, trying to find them on site at an event. So, I do think there's some real beauty to blending all of this. (16:47-17:18)
Sarah: Absolutely. And that's a great segue way into you Nolan, into kind of walk us through what are some of those engagement features as best planners look to technology companies like yourselves at Socio to help facilitate these ongoing conversations? (17:20-17:33)
Nolan: Yeah, absolutely. Like I was saying before, what a crazy time that we're living in and we're seeing all of this stuff evolve. You know, I lead the content discipline at Socio. So, in a lot of ways, I think of events as content, as milestones along that same customer journey. And you know, on the content side, on digital marketing side, you can measure the ROI. You can measure kind of everything you can. We're getting into multi-touch attribution. You can see what people are doing, what actions they're taking, what they're engaged with. Why can't we do that same thing for events? You know, so when I talk to the leaders at Socio and within the WebEx events portfolio, that's what they're really focused on right now is creating that full stack, all in one virtual hybrid in-person platform that really drives that continuous engagement. So being able to have features like, you know, in addition to if you think of the actual in-person events or the major events as milestones along those customer journeys, thinking about how you can kind of keep that community active in between so other smaller virtual events, hosting virtual roundtables or topic-based discussions, having networking opportunities and networking features, gamification, as we've mentioned before, a customized or personalized content. So, there's a lot of different opportunities, and I think that you're going to see from Socio and other platforms that idea of events being a bigger piece of that broader marketing effort and being able to tie those pieces together. So, someone who is visiting your website, someone who attends your virtual event, someone who attends your in-person event, being able to tie all of that together, being able to engage them, being able to see them as a single person along that journey and give them the experiences that they need to move through the funnel and to have the conversations that they need, that you need them to have to move them towards whatever solution you're offering and to evolve their event strategy. (17:34-19:24)
Annette: Yea Nolan I love that, that events are just one touch point, right, I think that we've always done. Again, we've been kind of singing this song a lot over the years, but we as event and meeting professionals, we need to remember to tie our efforts to the greater picture. And sometimes we can get a little siloed because events are pretty intense, and you're focused on getting them done, and you're marching toward a deadline, et cetera. So, we got to kind of lift our heads up a little bit, be a little more strategic in ok this is one of many touch points in this kind of engagement strategy or communications strategy. And how does it tie in to larger KPIs or, you know, net promoter scores of the organization? (19:24-20:04)
Nolan: Yeah, I mean, all across the board, we're having this discussion, right? It's not just about events, it's about hybrid work. It's how we're choosing to spend our time when we're choosing to decide that our physical body is necessary to have physical contact and when we don't. So, you know, making those choices, I think, is important. And, you know, thinking through the different ways that the technology can help enable those interactions and across the full customer journey is really critical. (20:05-20:32)
Sarah: Any, do any of you survey your attendees as well, I mean, I know Annette that meeting's outlook is essentially a survey, but how do you survey to really figure out what kinds of engagement? Because we can discuss this internally with our stakeholders and our teams in general. But you know, the level of engagement, how do you know what your audience is really seeking and looking for when we're talking about building these virtual communities? (20:35-21:02)
Annette: Well, 2 things come to mind. I mean, the first one is just people vote with their feet. You know, if you're on site at a live conference, people are going to tell you what they're interested in by going to or not, even just at IMEX last week. So IMEX did a great job in offering a lot of different styles of learning. They had deep dives for longer sessions. They had quick hits right on the show floor. So, you need to really offer all of that, even in the virtual environment, the digital environment. And then secondly, you know, it's really kind of an ongoing conversation. We can't just rely on one annual event data, know post-show survey, and you get to kind of, we hit them up four times a year with this meeting outlook survey because things change so quickly and we just need, especially nowadays, right? So, we need to just make sure that we have a more accurate and timely response of what they need now. So, we do survey often and we just layer that on with the trends that are happening. (21:04-22:01)
Nolan: You know, as far as you were just saying, people vote with their feet, you know, again on the content side, if somebody fills out a form and downloads a PDF, I'm excited and we're raising that person's lead score and we're potentially moving them further down the marketing funnel. If somebody gets on a plane, takes a week away from their family, and flies across the country to attend an event. That's a huge milestone and a huge indicator that that person is interested in the content that you're serving. And so, in making sure that we're using those touch points where people are so active and so obviously interested in in the industry and what you have to say, I think is really critical. (22:02-22:38)
Dale: I think things are just changing so quickly as well, and they still are. You know, I think that what we think, what we thought 2 weeks ago is often changed within 2 weeks. So, I think that's the other thing we have to be very cognitive of is it's just the fast change of how people are behaving at the moment as well because as Annette said, you know, our numbers tailed off in this, you know this for us jobs, it did once people started going back to events, once they started getting busy with work again. So, I think that we have to realize that perhaps these long, full day events are not possibly what our industry is needing or wanting anymore. But we need to think about these maybe shorter, engaged community events with different individuals. So that's, I think, something that we all are going to have to keep in mind that I don't think anyone can predict behavior or the future at the moment. So, we have to go with what we see happening as we do it. (22:40-23:45)
Annette: I agree, Dale, I think that the value proposition to get people to tune in online, we have to be targeted and we have to know what they want and deliver that community especially. I love the idea of just vertical communities, you know, find the people that they're looking for better and faster and deliver that kind of niche so it can be a conversation of value. (23:46-24:06)
Nolan: And Dale, earlier you were saying, you know, that you get a ton of value out of in-person events, and I think that's really critical and there's always going to be people who prefer in-person events who want to attend those personal events. But I think we've reached a point now where we can't go backwards and say, now we're going to shut out, you know, all the virtual attendees and people who may want to engage with their content, either virtually and not in person, or on demand in their own time. All of those types of things that reach the expanded reach that we've been able to have by having this type of technology is huge, and I don't see us taking a step backwards, but having something like a platform like Socio and others that allow you to have both of those, to have a seamless sort of event experience, and even also to be able to pivot if who knows, something happens with the pandemic or a hurricane or a weather event, whatever it is that cancels your in-person event, being able to quickly pivot so you can still serve all your audiences is something that I think Socio and other platforms like that have carved a space out for themselves for. (24:07-25:10)
Dale: Definitely. I think we just need to be alert to constant change now. And I think that goes back on that and sort of says, oh no, it's all over again would be foolish. I think that would be a very foolish move because we don't know what the future is going to hold at all. (25:11-25:26)
Sarah: Yeah, I keep saying, I go to a boxing gym for my workout, and I bob and weave as like part of the workout, and I feel like when I'm bobbing and weaving through my work and I'm like, this is exactly what our industry has had to do and continues to do as we move forward because there really is no expert, right? Like none of us here are the experts at what's next, because you're right, things change so quickly. So, you just have to keep bobbing, weaving through all of this journey that we're on. But what's great is that there are some really smart people like yourselves and people that are committed to making the event experience both in-person and online. You know, just engaging and meaningful and impactful. And that's exactly why we're all in this space to create that for others. So, I think that is something that we're going to continue to evolve in and learn from one another. So that's why these conversations are so important for us to have because we've all had variations of good, bad, and everything in between over the past couple of years through this. So, thank you all so much. Is there any final words that you'd like to leave our audience with? (25:27-26:38)
Annette: Well, I did, I don’t, I would like to just encourage everybody that we talk about that, you know, it's complicated and that you need to really dove in to all the different options. And at the same time, I just want to encourage everybody that these partners, like we've worked Socio super well, they make it easy for the meeting producer, they really do. Their platforms are so sophisticated that they make it easy on us as the producers, and they have wonderful service teams that guide you through. So, I just I don't want folks to be intimidated about jumping into this space. It's absolutely space that every meeting professional needs to be comfortable in because like we all said, it's going to be for a long time, and it's a great opportunity for us to just deepen the engagement with our audiences, and extend the relationship throughout the year instead of a one hit touchpoint during the event. So just wanted to say I'm really appreciative to the partnership again with Socio and how well they take care of their customers because it's a lot for a meeting professional to think about. But they know, they know their product, they know the end result. And actually, after you get in there, it's really, really fun to craft these online experiences. (26:39-27:52)
Nolan: Thank you for saying that. And I just wanted to thank you guys for having me and for the conversation. You know, Socio was founded by event and meeting professionals, so we understand that. Is it exciting for an incredible career and can also be stressful, especially in the last year plus, we have that, I've taken that into account. Our job is to make your life easier. You know, the biggest thing that got me excited about coming onto the Socio team was learning and hearing from our customers and just how much they love the product, how easy it is to use, how much it makes their life easier. So, my last words will just be anybody who is meeting and event professional. Keep your head up, we know it's hard, you're doing amazing. The world's changing, nobody knows what's in the future, but we've got your back. So, thank you again for having us and we appreciate the conversation and good to see you, ladies last week and to talk to you today. (27:53-28:43)
Sarah: Wonderful. Those are some great words to close on, and I'll just close by saying you all of the above, yes, all of the above and trust your partners. As Nolan just said, you're not on an island by yourself, it takes a village. And that's what partners like Socio and others are there to do is they've done the legwork, they know what you're looking for, they know that you're struggling with engagement. You're struggling with maybe generating new sponsorship opportunities through virtual. So, lean on your partners and trust them as they guide you through all of the unknowns. So, with that, thank you to all three of you for joining us on this podcast. Always a pleasure chatting with you. (28:45-29:22)
Nolan: Thank you. Thanks for having us. (29:23-29:24)
Dale: Thanks, Sarah. (29:25-29:26)
Annette: Thanks, Sarah. (29:27)
